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2.7 wg - hard to start and cut out

2003 WG 2.7 DIESEL 230,000KLMS
Hi - first post
I RECENTLY BOUGHT THIS 2003 JEEP - # 4 & 5 INJECTORS HAVE BEEN REPLACED WITH NEW UNITS AND 1,2,& 3 HAD WASHERS only REPLACED RECENTLY.
Car is always slow to start - hot or cold - never fires up immediately ,usually requires 2 hits of starter motor . Once running it seemed fine. No fuel leaking can be seen.
Today , while I was travelling up hilly road at 100% throttle setting -engine cut out completely - pulled over - turned ignition off then restarted fairly easily. Engine light stays on.
Is it time to consider new high pressure pump and servicing the other 3 injectors.
Are remanufactured pumps worth their money , or do I bit the bullet and buy a new Bosch pump

First thing - Read this: http://www.ausjeepoffroad.com/forum/...d.php?t=124873

Second thing - Check for codes or you could be wasting your time and money. (the key on, off, on dance 3 times, leave on)

Third thing - When was the last time your auto was serviced.

Seriously though this latest issue could be anything from another sensor to problems with the auto you really need to check for any codes and you need to make sure the auto fluid is fresh and at the correct level. You also need to make sure the battery is in tip top shape any time you have issues as it can also be a culprit. By tip top I don't just mean it starts the car but does it pass a load test.

Your cut out issues could be linked to the starting if it were say the fuel pressure regulator or sensor.

There are also a heap of recent threads on hard starting issues with the 2.7 so in the absence of rehashing you should really search and start reading.

2.7 hard to start

Quote:

Originally Posted by almc3 (Post 1527449)

Thanks Fester - good info
I accessed the fault codes and came up with only P1130 - low rail fuel pressure and code 0340 - camshaft position sensor. After researching the cam sensor , prices range from $30 on usa ebay for a knock off copy to a genuine MB unit for $180 . I then removed sensor (nice job) cleaned with brake clean and refitted - seemed to work for a 2 days but is now once again reluctant to start.

I purchased a genuine Bosch cam sensor from a US Euro Sprinter web site for about $50 but sorry have deleted the link off my computer since I have sold the car. Bodgie has used the same site so ask him. Don't forget these codes can be wiring related too not specifically the sensor itself. The manual has some trouble shooting to isolate a bit more.

I have ordered a code reader to clear the codes to see if the problem has logged another fault .

Don't mean to bust your bubble but what code reader did you buy. Very few actually work with the 2.7 unless you spend serious dollars.
Transmission was serviced 29,000 ago - no tranny fault code came up
Someone suggested to use a MD270 fuel filter that only has fuel in and fuel out
connections eliminating the two lines to the RGV - these lines are just connected together and allegedly drain back to the tank - reason being they
can cause aeration in filter/diesel supply. - could you please comment .

Couple have done this, Drover has blanked his off and bypassed it so same result with no dramas. Some had reported problems. Only thing is some of those with out the valve also don't have water sensor.
As the cut out problem could have fatal consequences - eg engine cuts out while overtaking , I am most concerned - computer does not place vehicle in limp home mode - just cuts out completely.
I guess the first place to start is change fuel filter , clear codes and road test on deserted uphill road- if it still happens next step clean out tank and lines checking for flow restriction and air entry.

Fuel filter could be an issue but it is unlikely that the rest of the lines and tank are flow restriction issues. Not impossible of course. I wouldn't be paying someone to troubleshoot that way. Air of course it can be and temporary clear fuel lines in place of the rubber ones can help and the hard ones of course are clear. Air problems should be visible.

Then on to injectors and possible hi press pump - quoted $660 for rebuilt pump and $95 each for cleaned and tested injectors - is that a good price ?

I'm sure Bodgie got a new pump for around that money and will attest that new is far better than recon. You can buy a kit for the high pressure pump for about $40 and put it in yourself as a moderate step but is not a full rebuild. Make sure a commercially supplied rebuilt pump is a FULL rebuild. Rebuilt injectors for example are not fully rebuilt. you can buy a kit yourself cheap to test leakback of your injectors, it's been covered on here. I'm not sure of the valve of clean and test myself.

I figure serviced injectors on #1,2and 3
wold be an economic solution as #4 & 5 have brand new injectors already fitted at cost of around $600 each
Your comments are most appreciated - as mentioned this problem could have fatal consequences .
I recently bought another Jeep Cherokee Limited 2003 2.7 from the hail auctions in Brisbane for $2500. that I going use for offroading - when I checked the codes - same thing - 1130 , 0340 as well as 0702,0836,0620,0560'1511 - tranny and generator faults - when I road tested up same hill - car cut out completely - seems like a common fault. Alternator works perfectly , so some of the faults were caused by driving with flat battery by Auction staff.
Regards Almc

You are talking about injectors and pump but are not covering off on the fuel pressure regulator or the pressure sensor.

That engine shut down can actually be a limp mode for the box. That's what mine did but of course was accompanied by a trans code. In my case an 0703. In the case of your Cherokee given it has a 0702 up it could a trans limp mode condition. Don't forget the trans can go into limp mode because it's not happy with the output of an engine sensor. The trans in limp mode is not specifically only ever related to the trans itself.

Good luck.

The old 1130 code, in my experience this can mean one of a dozen things.

If it is cutting out at high revs I reckon the fuel rail may not be hitting the required pressure which causes the ECU to shutdown the engine. This could be caused by excessive back leakage of the injectors which will hit the fuel pressure regulator and say this isn't good and shut down the engine.

As Fester said buy a leakback tester and check the return fuel volume. If one injector is higher than the others after a couple of minutes of idling this injector could be the cause of your problem.

Once again Fester is on the money, don't waster the money on getting the injectors tested/cleaned, invest that in new injectors. Last time I priced them they were around the $500 mark from a Bosch agent.

I bought a new pump from MB a couple of years back for under $600 so check your pricing there. If the pump isn't leaking I'd sort the injectors first.

Also don't discount a problem with the fuel pressure regulator either.

Locally MB is a good place to buy engine parts, way cheaper than Jeep. MB Spares in Canberra is an option if you have time, http://europarts-sd.com is also very good for MB parts. Look for the 2002-2006 Sprinter parts.

Jason

Quote:

Originally Posted by bodgie (Post 1527468)

MD Spare in Canberra

MB Spares, if you haven't noticed your typo yet Jason.

Thanks for the info
Would like to buy new injectors but the price is over the top , especially for the $2500 I paid for the 2nd jeep from the auctions - injectors cost as much as the car !
I will buy the leak off test kit and replace any injector that is out of spec.
Euro Parts still has cam sensors for $39.95.
Fester - liked your idea of clear fuel lines -could save a lot of guess work. I'm working on the theory the first Jeep runs well around the city and at 110kph on highway - seem to accelerate well , but on full noise going up hills cannot deliver
enough fuel to pump - and maybe air leak causes hard starting - nice theory to start with- after that the wallet will have to come out !
Appreciate your comments - could save a life
Is there any way of clearing logged faults without reader - on certain vehicles removal of one of the circuit breakers for 60 seconds clears all faults -any such luck with 2003 jeeps.