E10 petrol

[Nanook]

Originally Posted by Banshee

So if it is there & sits for a long time it can cause corrosion. But a non issue in a DD as enough motion will keep it mixed until used & the turnover is sufficient to prevent it sitting. Unless you get a LOT of water in the tank, in which case you'll be FUBAR either way.

That's exactly the point I was trying to make

There is no harm in using E10 as long as there is a high turn over in both your tank and the servo that you bought it from.

I don't like using E10 personally unless I know I'm going to use a lot of it, for example, if I'm spending the day on the beach which chews up the juice, I'll fill up with E10 because its cheap and I know it will get used.

Any other time I will always use 91 (thankfully my local servo sells both 91 and E10) or 95 because mine's not a daily driver and can sit in the garage for weeks without even being started.

My Hilux only uses E10 and it's never had a problem as it gets filled at least once a week because it's constantly driven.

Now what was the original question?

[Banshee]

At least the JK doesn't have to worry about the fuel tank corroding. The only metal part is the tank skid...

And if you are getting water/ethanol/fuel mix on it, you have more to worry about than the water in the fuel!

[Old_Dog]

Quote: layback40
... An old method for getting condensation out of a fuel tank was to drain the fuel, ...

I remember an old Jack Absalom tip thirty plus years ago when filling up with petrol at a one horse town with perhaps dodgy fuel. He suggested pouring in a cup of metho and then filling up with petrol. The metho would take care of any water in the tank or in the servo's petrol.

Old Jack was always full of suggestions on keeping his Chrysler (or Mitsubishi) Stigma going in the middle of nowhere. Most of his shows are available on YouTube if you want a laugh. However, I can tell you that I wouldn't let Jack anywhere near a modern car! He was a funny but talented bugger with a strong opinion on just about everything.

[Banshee]

Aircraft all have drain taps. One of the preflight checks is to drain the water out of the tanks.

When commercial aircraft are at altitude the outside air temp is ~ -45C to -56C (from memory) & the water freezes out of the fuel. After the plane lands, you tended to get rained on after a while, as the ice in the tanks caused condensation & frost on the underside of the wings, which subsequently melted & dripped on you as you worked there...

[OzRick25]

My understanding of the potential issues with ethanol is that in isolation and turned over quickly it's fine CH3CH2OH + 3O2 + heat and pressure = 2C02 + 3H2O big deal carbon dioxide and water your doing plants a favour!

However the problem isnt with the ethanol it's with the sulpher either in the cheap ethanol fuel, or the cheap 91 still in the tank, or in the cheap oil you saved a few dollars on + the modern crank case ventilation and in the case of the 3.8 the bad rings leading to high oil consumption.

S+O2 + pressure and heat = SO2 then + O2 + pressure and heat = 2SO4 then + 2H2O + pressure and heat = 2H2SO4 (sufuric acid) + O2. Also 4SO2 + 2H20 + heat and pressure = 2H2SO4 + O2

Now that sulfuric acid may then react with more ethanol and form ethene and more water but it may stay as acid and damage your engine and exhaust (particularly the cats) as well as the environment.

In Australia the allowable sulphur content in our petrol is 10 times that in the US where our cars were designed and where e10 was considered to be fine (pre 08 it was up to 50 times higher).... A lot of Australians also live in hot humid areas with high water content in the intake air.

Occasional use from a high turnover station and that you use fairly quickly probably won't do any long term damage at all it might even help clean some carbon deposit. Even with prolonged use it's going to take a while for the relatively low levels of sulfuric acid to show you what they have done, but science says they are there and they aren't great for engines.

If you turn your car's over every 3 to 5 years you probably can run ethanol and high sulphur oil in Darwin during the wet season even in the 2 stroke 3.8l and not be concerned. If I had a high compression low oil use engine in a cool low moisture level climate, was confident in low sulpher fuel and used fully synthetic low sulpher oil I'd use e10 all day every day. However my Jeep is long term and for the above reasons I dont .

[layback40]

Originally Posted by Banshee

Aircraft all have drain taps. One of the preflight checks is to drain the water out of the tanks.

When commercial aircraft are at altitude the outside air temp is ~ -45C to -56C (from memory) & the water freezes out of the fuel. After the plane lands, you tended to get rained on after a while, as the ice in the tanks caused condensation & frost on the underside of the wings, which subsequently melted & dripped on you as you worked there...

Aircraft have an inspection sample point & a sample of fuel is taken from each tank during pre flight inspection. If any water or other substance is found in the fuel the aircraft doesnt take off until it is fully investigated. They are not just water drains taps.

[Nanook]

Hopefully the Jeep won't fall as far as an aircraft if water stops the engine.