Are new Jeep shifters too complicated or are people too stupid?

[jjgc]

Yes we were taught to use the hand brake first then leave in gear or park.
I have read some where on the forums that the Americans refer to the hand brake as an emergency brake, so less inclined to use it as the main means of holding the car.
But I under stand thing can happen when in a hurry and not concentrating.

[spoondog]

Originally Posted by Tyvokka

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/nhtsa-in...rand-cherokee/

"I got out of the Jeep. I thought it was in park and it was in reverse still. And as I walked back towards the garage, I noticed it was moving a little bit and I didn't want to ruin the car after having it just for a few months so I got between the car and the garage and I was able to yell for my son and stop the car at the same time,"

If people are this stupid then there is just no helping them.

[st_za]

In my experience as a software engineer, just because the overwhelming majority finds a way to use a tool successfully doesn't mean that it is easy to use but neither does one person having a problem mean that the tool is at fault (we call it PEBKAC, it would be PEBSWAC for cars).

I think it's pretty clear to everyone by now that the shifter isn't as intuitive as it could have been but it's also clear that it doesn't mean that it is a problem.

I want to know why the WK2 (and just about every modern Jeep) doesn't use their fly-by-everything systems and sensors everywhere to act intelligently. Engage the hill-hold function when you shift from R or D to N, especially if a door is opened. Bypass it by switching on your hazards (for towing). Lock the shifter if you are still moving in reverse and want to change from N to D but then apply the brakes to stop too. Etc.

None of this will change anything about the shifter but it will make the whole car more idiot-proof than it is now and that can't be a bad thing, can it?

BTW how do you get that transmission out of gear if the battery is dead and you need to tow it or load it onto a flatbed?

[Tyvokka]

Originally Posted by spoondog

"I got out of the Jeep. I thought it was in park and it was in reverse still. And as I walked back towards the garage, I noticed it was moving a little bit and I didn't want to ruin the car after having it just for a few months so I got between the car and the garage and I was able to yell for my son and stop the car at the same time,"

If people are this stupid then there is just no helping them.

I am in no way an expert nor an arm chair expert. I suppose the people at NHTSA with college degrees and privvy to the problems know a little bit more than "people are stupid" kinda attitudes or opinions.

NHTSA's announcement shows that consequences from bad control design go far beyond being mere inconveniences. Consumers report 306 incidences of Grand Cherokees rolling away when parked with the engine running, causing 117 crashes and 28 injuries. Another four crashes and two injuries are attributed to the 300 and Charger.

Much of this risk can be avoided simply by programming the transmission to automatically select Park once the engine is shut off or the driver's door opens, whichever comes first. Indeed, other car companies with similar complicated shifter designs use this logic. Instead, the Chrysler stays in Neutral and doesn't even let you shut off the engine if the car isn't in gear. Possibly intended as a failsafe, this design quirk doesn't seem to protect drivers from the error.

[TR Laredo]

Originally Posted by st_za

BTW how do you get that transmission out of gear if the battery is dead and you need to tow it or load it onto a flatbed?

Page 327-328 of the owners manual refers to a manual Park release which can be used to shift the transmission out of park when the vehicle has say a dead battery. To operate:
Firmly apply the parking brake;
Open center console, locate the manual release cover and remove it by snapping the cover away from the console hinges;
Using a screwdriver or similar tool push the metal latch in towards the tether strap;
While the metal latch is in the open position simultaneously pull upwards on the tether strap until the lever clicks & latches in the released position;
The transmission is now out of park & the vehicle can now be moved.

To disengage the manual park release apply tension upward while pushing the release latch towards the tether to unlock the lever
Once tension has been released and the lever has been unlocked be sure it is stowed properly & locks into position;
Replace cover by snapping it back in place.


Cheers

[Clarky]

"850,000 vehicles"
"claims reports of 121 crashes"
I think the percentage speaks for itself.
Natural selection

Indicator stalk on jeeps (not just Jeeps) is on the left hand side of the steering wheel, not intuitive for us right hook drivers but we adapt

I think the park brake should automatically apply itself when the drivers door is opened to protect the really dumb ones.

[Tyvokka]

Originally Posted by Clarky

"850,000 vehicles"
"claims reports of 121 crashes"
I think the percentage speaks for itself.
Natural selection

Indicator stalk on jeeps (not just Jeeps) is on the left hand side of the steering wheel, not intuitive for us right hook drivers but we adapt

I think the park brake should automatically apply itself when the drivers door is opened to protect the really dumb ones.

I always get my indicators mixed up when switching between my Jeeps, Zook, Nissan and Vee Dub. Ending up squirting the windshield when I want to flash the headlights.

I also nearly killed myself after having ridden Jap bikes then one day riding a English Triumph 650. I arrived at a T junction and instead of hitting the footbrake on the right, it was the gear and went neutral instead. Scary shit..

I don't think I'm stupid nor dumb. Just my brain has a certain pattern and I reverted to the learnt behaviour. Patterns aren't easy to break.