Myths and fairy tails about the VM TD - Page 2 - AUSJEEPOFFROAD.COM - AJOR


Go Back   AUSJEEPOFFROAD.COM - AJOR > JEEP GARAGE > XJ / MJ Cherokee


Portal Register Forums Trading Your Jeep New Garage Mark All Read

Post New Thread  Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #9  
Old 01-06-2010
Persep  Persep is offline
Established Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 110
What Jeep do I drive?: XJ
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Read somewhere ages ago that car manufacturers won't fit linear gauges coz they create unrest -- ppl just don't like seeing that needle creep. So they actually forced some poor engineer to deliberately create gauges that act like a indicator light. You might as well have a light on the dash that glows red when there's trouble. (Come to think that's exactly what my old HQ holden did have )

Don't know if it's true or not....
__________________
Why spoil a perfectly good morning by getting up in it?
  #10  
Old 01-06-2010
sbadman's Avatar
sbadman  sbadman is offline
RustysRocker
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Western Sydney
Age: 36
Posts: 495
What Jeep do I drive?: XJ
Likes: 1
Liked 6 Times in 3 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Persep View Post
You might as well have a light on the dash that glows red when there's trouble. (Come to think that's exactly what my old HQ holden did have )

Don't know if it's true or not....
Some modern cars I've driven have no temp gauge, they have a red light for overheating, and some of them have a blue light for not warmed up yet
  #11  
Old 01-06-2010
vk2icj's Avatar
vk2icj  vk2icj is offline
CrawlerStar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Castle Hill NSW
Age: 50
Posts: 309
What Jeep do I drive?: JK
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

I always struggle with how long to warm an engine up. My manual clearly states not to idle for more than 5 minutes as this contributes to glazing. It also says to idle for 1 minute to lube the turbo before driving. I wait the minute and then drive reasonably until the water guage reads normal and then I just drive normal. However driving reasonably seems to lag the engine more. Is there a good choice?
  #12  
Old 01-06-2010
TheOoz's Avatar
TheOoz  TheOoz is offline
Full Flexer
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Western Sydney
Posts: 972
What Jeep do I drive?: XJ
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

vk2icj I'd go on the long side of 1 minute, and then drive without labouring the engine. Normal driving within the warm up period is okay, particularly in a 4WD where torque is delivered down low. The key is not to thrash it during warm up.
__________________
Los grandes de América!
Sponsored Posts
  #13  
Old 01-06-2010
Deezelweazel's Avatar
Deezelweazel  Deezelweazel is offline
Full Flexer
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Germany
Posts: 1,000
What Jeep do I drive?: XJ
Likes: 1
Liked 21 Times in 14 Posts
Default

Idle is very important- but the main reason is to supply the turbocharger with oil. Because the charger is a supplemental external device and the last unit which receives oil.
Don't idle longer than necessary- EGR opens during partial load(including idle) and soot builds up quickly in the intake. I had to scrape out 3-5mm of soot after 100k.
But anything longer than a minute during cold conditions is waste of Diesel.

The shut down prodedure is even more important. You would be amazed to see engine temperatures climbing after shut down!

Water temperature may be ok-but oil temperature will be at a safe operating temperature after the double distance- if you drive without load!

Last edited by Deezelweazel; 01-06-2010 at 05:31 AM.
  #14  
Old 01-06-2010
Antiferret's Avatar
Antiferret  Antiferret is offline
Full Flexer
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 533
What Jeep do I drive?: XJ
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deezelweazel View Post
I'm going to pick on the vintage iron gasser engine layout, when done here.
By the way, who is telling the old fairy tale about being used as a boat engine? Engine design is not made as a cold running engine. As can be seen on the alloy bearing carrier rings.
This engine was used with great reliability and success in austrian agricultural machines(Reform)under heavy load conditions.
Engine setup is different. Lower charger pressure and different cooling layout with a much lower red zone.

Did anyone recognized the manipulated engine coolant temperature display? It stays locked around 90° to 100°- in case of overheating the needle jumps suddenly to the red zone! This is not possible with a linear reading meter.
sorry about the boat engine thingy, this thread is titled "myths and fairytails..." i am adamant that it would still make a good boat anchor if it breaks

perhaps the engineers should have spent more time modifying the block?
agricultural use in Austria is hardly stop start conditions in an Australian summer.

Deez, would copper head gaskets and a really good low viscosity synthetic oil (changed at same regular intervals) go some way to prevent the VM's dramas?

the toyota boys (in the earlier model 3.0l supras) claim an elimination of blown gaskets while still allowing the head to 'wander'.

and todays modern full synthetics have far greater lubricity at a greater range of temps. they have a lower viscosity for a given application, lubricating internals sooner and evenly spreading heat better.
__________________
When Ferret & Antiferret combine, Annihilation!
Sponsored Posts
  #15  
Old 01-06-2010
Yom  Yom is offline
DetroitDemon
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 4,678
What Jeep do I drive?: JK
Likes: 45
Liked 85 Times in 54 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Antiferret View Post
how come they couldn't have maybe included a wally factor like the patrol 4.2 diesels?
There's no wally factor on the patrol 4.2 diesel.

The only reason it lasts so long and appears so bulletproof is because it doesn't generate enough power to hurt itself. low boost, low combustion temps and immense exhaust emissions which is why it NEVER saw use in europe.

If you overheat a TD42 you will hurt it same as any other motor. And yes, the TD42 has a very nasty habit of running too warm, there'd have to be hundreds of threads on the internet about it and hundreds of mechanics who reckon they can fix it.

It might be less temperamental than the VM 2.5 in the XJ but there's a big difference in basic design and intended use.
  #16  
Old 01-06-2010
Deezelweazel's Avatar
Deezelweazel  Deezelweazel is offline
Full Flexer
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Germany
Posts: 1,000
What Jeep do I drive?: XJ
Likes: 1
Liked 21 Times in 14 Posts
Default

It's all good, bud
-over here they think in fact it is a boat engine,hehehe.

no, copper is simply to soft. You can o-ring the head gasket, but that is race tech and not really cheap, because it's not an ordinary o-ring. It's a nitrogen filled ring and the heads have to be prepared for that.


the "wander" is what kills your head gaskets- because you have 4 of them and pressure of a Diesel is way higher than a gasser- it will "lift" your heads
To prevent that, I switched to ARP studs- the original bolts have to much stretch.
As I already said: the fun gets expensive...

The Synthetic oil has better heat carrier abilities.
I use Mobil1 TurboDiesel 0 W40 during the summer and Mobil 1 Delvac 5W40 in the winter, I can afford to buy it, because I got cheaper 60l drums.
More is less expensive. It is still overkill and I had to reseal the complete engine- it started to drip everywhere.

Be warned!
Before you can use that thin viscosity you have to check bearing tolerances. If the crank is worn out already you get a real dangerous pressure drop!
Rebuilding is questionable.

But you still have to get rid of the oil heat.
The water/oil cooler is not enough to provide sufficient cooling. It also brings heat back into the water circuit- not good at all.

I use an additional oil cooler with 500cm². That seems to be huge, but it is only 10cm by 50cm- BMW uses the same size in their 2.5 Diesels.

Last edited by Deezelweazel; 01-06-2010 at 07:53 AM. Reason: correcting spelling + adding info
Post New Thread  Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On





All times are GMT +10. The time now is 03:37 AM.




AJOR does not vouch for or warrant the accuracy, completeness or usefulness of any message, and are not responsible for the contents of any message. The messages express the views of the author of the message, not necessarily the views of AJOR or any entity associated with AJOR, nor should any advice be substituted as technical advice replacing that of a mechanic. You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use AJOR to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, religious, political or otherwise violative of any law. You agree not to post any copyrighted material unless the copyright is owned by you or by AJOR. The owner, administrators and moderators of AJOR reserve the right to delete any message or members for any or no reason whatsoever. You remain solely responsible for the content of your messages, and you agree to indemnify and hold harmless AJOR, the administrators, moderators, and their agents with respect to any claim based upon transmission of your message(s). The use of profile signatures to intentionally mislead or misdirect any member on this forum is not acceptable and may result in your account being suspended. Any trip that is organised through the AJOR forum is participated at your own risk. If you or your vehicle is damaged it is your responsibility, not that of the person that posted the thread, message or topic initiating the trip, nor the organisers of AJOR or moderators of any specific forum. This forum and associated website is the property of AJOR.





Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

AJOR © 2002 - 2018 AUSJEEPOFFROAD.COM. All corporate trademarked names and logos are property of their respective owners. Ausjeepoffroad is in no way associated with DaimlerChrysler Corporation or Fiat Jeep.
www.midlifemate.com wayalife.com jkwrangler.com ausjeepforum.com jk-forum.com canadianjeepoffroad.com
vB Ad Management by =RedTyger=