I killed my XJ

[rastus2571]

Well only had it for going on 5 weeks now and I killed my XJ. Drove fine to work this morning and have had no auto problems at all.

I have a slight top tank coolant leak from the radiator and a very slight auto fluid weep where the top cooler line goes into the rad. Have been keeping both topped up until I can get another rad in it.

Started it up today to come home and coolant is pissing out of the auto pan.
I shut it down real quick:mad:

We all know what that means.

I had only just rang junglejuice today about a copper/brass radiator I bought. Also got a new water pump (may as well replace it when the rad is out) and already have new hoses.We were talking about rads when he came over my house on Sunday.

I know for a fact just flushing the auto out is still going to cause problems down the track as coolant inside an auto starts corrosion, rusts solenoids and also disintegrates the band material. I may be lucky but flushing is just going to have to do for now and I'll keep my fingers and everything else crossed.

I am going to do what I did to an offroad racer I raced many years ago.This is not the first time I have had this problem on my vehicles.

I am going to mount a large auxillary cooler up under the floorpan towards the rear with air scoops, with thermos and a trans temp gauge and that will stop this happening again and also stop the problem of squashed auto lines on the XJ from RHF wheel up articulation when the control arm bracket crushes the lines.

This is whats going in it.

http://www.daviescraig.com.au/Oil_Coolers-30_PLATE_TRANSMISSION_COOLER___10_inch_THERMATIC_F AN_COMBO___PART_No__691-details.aspx

It won't cost me that much though.

What was that saying about Jeeps costing money?

I'll get it towed to the workshop t/m and get my mate Steve onto it.

Hohum,,,,,,,,,,,,,such is life. But other than that I had a great day at work, ya gotta take the good with the bad.:D

[bruggz351]

Bad luck rastus...
Looks as though you have it sorted though...
Good luck man..

cheers

[rastus2571]

I am going to try mate. SO UNHAPPY JAN..MY BABY. It's sittng in the yard at work atm awaiting the tow truck t/m to fix her. I got home by bringing a 57 seat coach home. Parked in the yard. It's great being the boss.

However this coach ain't gunna be too good offroad.

Got the rad from repco on the account copper/brass $310.00. Rang junglejuice about it b4 I bought it
Water pump $62. May as well do it while I got everything out. Preventative maintenance.
Top and lower hoses $38.

[brenttj]

if you need a trans mate has one

[Easy Rollins 1]

$70 poly bumpstops from Wooders will stop you crushing the cooler lines.

Putting a cooler underneath will be a waste of time IMHO,it will fill with mud the first time offroad.

[anthonygubbin]

$70 poly bumpstops from Wooders will stop you crushing the cooler lines.

Putting a cooler underneath will be a waste of time IMHO,it will fill with mud the first time offroad.

I am going to rerout my lines as I too crushed them on the upflex. If I was to extend the bump stops enough to prevent crushing I would lose to much up travel.
Re the cooler, mine is in the front by the rad and has no issues getting cool enough and I tow nearly everyday 750+kgs and my oil is never been dark enough to need a flush at each 20k service so she aint getting too hot. From my experience up the front is ok, IMO no need to stick it down low.

regards A

[rastus2571]

It won't fill with mud Easy. It get's a bit in but never fills. I do side port funnels coming across,down and then funnel up into the cooler. Bit hard to describe from what I am saying. This is what we ran on the racer.Not on an XJ though.

How can I put it,

Well It was put all the way down the chassis behind the original fuel tank up under the floorpan. I am goingt o mount mine behind the original XJ standard tank. Work in proress behind that tank. Will report on efficiency. The second tank on the racer was mid mounted. More or less it is up on a 45 degree angle at the tank bolted on brackets with scoops(described) to get airflow.

Away from the radiator it does not produce latent heat into the radiator.

We need to get as much heat away from the rad as we can. The poor thing has enough to deal with already.

Way away from any heat source. No worries about flex or breaking mounts. It was mounted to the floor pan after the tanks on 2x2 box section. Very little crap in it. Trust me.

We proved it when we raced. Scoops do pick up mud. Very little after we sorted it. Got mud in but not the big chunks.

More or less,

The scoops run down and then up so the hard crap is chucked down and away. It still picks up mud. The scoops we made were out of 1mm alloy plate.

They were made to go around the sides of the cooler bolted into the mount plates where the cooler bolted onto the frame.

The edges we run down at 45 degrees were made to flow crap out.Chuck it out so to speak.

Around the second set of plates,bolted to the same. Next to these we made 90 degree angles to flow up after the first set. Back up to the cooler and channeled around the edges.

Just let me get in in to show you all.


II don't have any pics to show you how it works. On the FJ40 very little crap got thrown up near the tank.

John Fenwick of Newcastle 4wd used to run a CJ-7 with this setup and my old mate Rick Williams (from Bushdriver Magazine now defunct) did the same. John used to also run a Cherokee 360ci in Class 8 off road racing. Two door model. Cherokee Chief. I don't know the models and I am not going to go seraching for them . I do enough searching for stuff for you guys on here.

I got a panel guy at work who knows exactly what I am after.

Never clogged with mud. It did get mud but not filled up to stop working. It never overheated or went wild on the temps.

Let me get it in and I'll take pics to show you. It works. Just let me set it up and I'll show you how with pics.

It sort of as I can describe it channels the crap down and out and funnels air into the cooler. Never had any crap block it.

Of course we got mud into it (very little and it never blocked it) but your going to get that anyway with a front mount cooler.

Just let me get it setup and I'll show you.

Not in the next 5 minutes though.

As I said the worst killer of autos is heat(and in my case bloody coolant in it)

Wait till I fit it and I'll post pics and a step by step of what to do.

Enuff for me for tonight on this one. Nite crew. Hope this helps.

[dazza96]

i got a good tested box if ya need it cheers daz

[rastus2571]

I'll keep that in mind dazza. I hope I won't need it. After I flush mine, my mech, Steve(my mechanic) and I will do a pressure test on the boxes systems. He is going to do a flush and pressure test on it and after I finish work I'll go down there and we will suss it out.

We will do a solenoid voltage and pressure test and check the bands then do a scan and test drive with the scantool on it.

It only happened this afternoon so I think it should be ok. I had not even moved the car. It just started when I had it idling with the A/C on cooling it down talking to my boss on the phone next to it when I noticed it.

I think it can be saved and ok.

[rastus2571]

If I need the box Dazza and further on down the track I know I will. My bands will start disintegrating due to being contaminated and the valve body will start to seize up.
How many hungy do you want for it?

PM if you want mate.

[BLU-125]

rastus, I may be wrong, but I don't think that "bands" and an AW-4 will ever occur in the same sentence. :)

Looking forward to your cooler install. I spent a lot of time under mine and couldn't find a suitable place. Am looking forward to being proved wrong.

[rastus2571]

Just going on what I am told mate. I am unfamiliar with the box. Not an automatic guy. I'll have a look at the manual. Full solenoid control .NO BANDS.
Thanks mate. I'll let my mechanic know as he is unfamiliar with them too.

I told him I was going to look at the manual tonight and get more info.

Maybe I am not going to have to get a new box then. Maybe a full flush and filter change hopefully will fix it. WHat do you think on this? Would anything possibly be damaged with the coolant in the box? I know it may corrode later on and start stuffing solenoids or will it from your experience be ok?

Your a champion. Thank you so much for that info.

As I have said I am not an automatic box guy.Have no experience on automatic repair and don't want to go there.

[BLU-125]

I would flush it, replace the filter, add an external cooler & go for it. It does hold a lot of ATF, about 12l from memory, but is a very strong box.

I bypassed the radiator heat exchanger (which I believe is your problem) and fitted the largest cooler I could find for a company trip to Fraser. All seemed to be fine.

Now I know about stacked plate coolers I am motivated to try your set up, so please keep me in the loop.

[rastus2571]

After reading your post BLU125 you have taken a lot of grief and anxiety off my mind.

After looking at the workshop manual (I had downloaded and I did not look before this problem happened,my fault I was so upset about this) it seems then that it may not have done any damage to the auto.

I am going to try the cooler mod I have envisaged (2nd thought now, rearward of the transfer case below the floor, junglejuice said the floor pan gets very hot, so what I am going to do is get it on the hoist running and hit it with the temp pointer gun, Just above the rear diff is looking great atm,looked today when she was up) and with the scoop plates for the airflow will let you guys know about it. I looked at the flow rates and temps with this coooler unit and it suits me fine. Just what I want.

I cannot fit this unit in front of the radiator without getting rid of the grille and running mesh. I really don't want to do this.

I want to keep the tranny cooler away from any latent heat whatsoever.

Gives my new rad the best chance too.

Leave me as the dumb bunny to try it on mine.

No mud atm as QLD is dry and dusty.

When I fit it I am going to have heap of line available if I have to plug it back into the original unit if needed in an emergency. I am leaving all original lines in place(dis-connected) and putting new fittings on the box to route it back but leaving the original fittings in situ and plugged so if it heats up I can re-connect back to standard if needed with a couple of spanners.

[rastus2571]

Well maybe the box is not as strong as thought. Mine is totally stuffed. I am getting it totally rebuilt and it is going to cost around $2000:00.

I am not going to put a second hand box. I can afford a rebuilt/new box.

It failed pressure test and solenoid activation on the bench and the converter has gone to the gods.

So just one minute of coolant pumping itself into the box killed it. As I said I started it,put the A/C on and was talking on the phone outside the car and saw coolant pissing out and shut it off right away.

Maybe not as strong as envisaged.

Just what we need coming up to XMAS.:(

[BLU-125]

I must admit that I am surprised that minimal water contamination can be so catastrophic. I've had a few of these things, and I am sure you know they use them in Isuzu & Toyota commercials, Supras, etc., none of which suggests good care and maintenance.

The valve body in my off-road XJ came out of a gearbox I found lying on the ground in a wreckers full of water.......I actually bought it to get the solenoids and the transfer case.

But hey, you know the quality of the staff you employ. ;)

[brenttj]

why reco it when you can buy a second hand one for like a quarter if the price makes no sense
even a brand new replacement is 1300 plus shipping

[Easy Rollins 1]

You'll double the price of that XJ.:roll:

[dazza96]

i reckon water was what killed my last gear box

[rastus2571]

Well I got my XJ back today after a week in the shop.

On my own vehicles guys, I am not keen on second hand when I don't know the history. I intend keeping this XJ for a long time so I want it right. Same as ths missus L-300 courier van. Her's just cost me $1483.60 yesterday with repairs. And that was cheap for what was done on it believe me. Not going to go into it.

I found this with quotes about the gearbox. Hmmm...Can't kill it? I sure did without even trying.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/under-the-hood/car-part-longevity/how-long-transmissions-last.htm

This is now what it has had done to it.

Where do I start?

Complete cooling system pressure backflush. (you would not believe the gloop/brown poo that came out of it I saw in the tub on the floor).

New copper/brass radiator.(main culprit).

New cap.(bit iffy and not sealing on the pressure test all the time).

All rad/heater hoses replaced.(was ok but replaced anyway).

New thermostat.(was ok but replaced anyway).

New waterpump. (was ok but replaced anyway).

Replaced idler bearings.(was ok but replaced anyway).

New serpentine belt. (had started to get the old splits).

Fan viscous clutch.(was ok but replaced anyway).

Whilst it was apart I also had the timing case cover resealed (not leaking) and new front crank seal done(slight oil weep). Due to being just over 200,000 km's I also had the cam and crank sprockets and chain replaced. The chain had a bit of slack in it.

So everything on the front of the motor,cooling sytem and auto is brand new.

New harmonic balancer.
The old one was a bit sad looking. I am all for preventative maintenance.

Rebuilt AW4 auto,new converter,transfer case front and rear shaft seals. Much more positive shift now and a lot better to drive.

When the original box was pulled apart the filter was clogged as hell and sludge was all through the valve bodies and the rest of the box. Box had been sent away to get rebuilt and is fully re-conditioned.

Changed transfer case fluid.

Cost....... let's just say a bit:)

Like driving a new car now.

Now what else is going to break.;)

And as for Easy saying I am going to double the price of the XJ? Well let's just say your not far off the mark on that.

[dazza96]

where did you get the timeing chain and sprockets from?
i have a bit of a rattle coming from front of motor
cheers daz

[rastus2571]

I'll ask my mechanic Steve on Monday Dazza. Mine is so quiet now you can just hear the injectors ticking. No coolant leaks and the auto is so smooth you cannot even feel it changing.

Still have to do the tranny cooler mod but that will be happening after XMAS.