TJ Rear Drums / Handbrake

[maggoo]

Hey guys

I recently rebuilt my rear drum brakes. (Springs, shoes and cylinder)

I am having issues adjusting my handbrake.
I have followed every guide on the net i have seen.

Adjusting them out until there is a slight rub then back it off a click
Trying the auto adjusters by reversing.
Etc...

I just cant get it to do anything.
I can still move the tyre by hand when the handbrake is on full.

I was wondering could it be my cables are stuffed?
Or my drums themselves need replacing?


I did notice this the other day when i pulled my drums off again to check everything.

When turning the adjuster wheel out the plate thing is where it is supposed to be

http://imageshack.us/a/img84/1436/img0051hc.jpg


When turning it the other way, where it is not ment to turn unless you push the plate out of the way. The plate moves and you can still turn the wheel.

http://imageshack.us/a/img37/312/img0052el.jpg


Not sure if that has anything to do with it but it intrigued me.

Any help would be much appreciated as i would like some form of handbrake.
And please don't say upgrade to rear disks haha. I don't have the money for that....


Cheers,
Paul

[mika]

hard to say why but I have a feeling you might need to adjust them a bit more. I found you need to adjust the brakes till you really start to notice the wheel getting hard to turn then back off a couple of clicks so you can turn the wheel but can still hear the shoes dragging slightly.
Or try the adjuster where the two hand brake cables meet.

[Sontssonts]

Is it just the hand brake that's not working? Or when you press te pedal as well?

[maggoo]

hard to say why but I have a feeling you might need to adjust them a bit more. I found you need to adjust the brakes till you really start to notice the wheel getting hard to turn then back off a couple of clicks so you can turn the wheel but can still hear the shoes dragging slightly.
Or try the adjuster where the two hand brake cables meet.


Hmm i was worried that if it was rubbing while driving it would wear my brake shoes out pretty fast
I have loosened the adjuster where the cables meet until its slack then tried to adjust the starwheel then went back and tightened the cable adjuster until it was firm.
But still didn't help.

The rear brakes work fine when i hit the pedal.
Its just the handbrake doesn't push the brake shoes out far enough to hold.

[hophoar]

what I do is pull the lever up 3 clicks then adjust the starwheel till its locks the drums, that should do until you get muddy then just repeat.

[bonza]

as you have had your brakes pulled apart you need to do a full set up

place jack stands under the rear axle and have both wheels off the ground

make sure the hand brake is released and back off the cable adjusting nut under the vehicle until cable is a little loose

remove the plug from the access hole on the brake support plate on both sides. the support plate is the sheet metal plate on the inboard side of the brakes and the access hole pretty well aligns with the star wheel. shine a torch in there and you should see it.

with a flat bladed screwdriver poke the blade thru the access hole and engage the adjusting star wheel

rotate the star wheel until drag can be felt on the wheel while turning it. the star wheel has a detent action and can only be turned one way, so trial and error to work out which direction. the opposite star adjuster on the other wheel will revolve the opposite direction, well, at least on all the brakes that I have ever worked on do.

adjust the cable back up until taught and test handbrake so when it is applied is tight onto the drum and the hand brake lever can be felt firm onto the drum, in other words the hand brake lever should only pull back a few clicks on the ratchet if all done ok

test vehicle and drive in reverse and apply brake pedal bringing jeep to a FULL stop in order for the auto adjusters to equalise. do this a few times, forward and reverse. Full stops must be executed otherwise complete waste of time. don't use the handbrake for doing this otherwise you will stretch the cable

if all the above fails and you really don't know what you are doing, take it to a brake specialist as they are too important to stuff around with. besides, brake repairs aren't that expensive anyway

[Wooders]

When you refitted the adjuster screw did you mount it the right way around? (ie the "fixed" end should be at the rear and the extending end toward the front of the vehicle).
If there tension in the cable? (check at the equalizer).

[Jonny Jeep]

A common problem is not sitting the cable guide flush to the shoe. Which is what I suspect is the problem from seeing the second picture.

[bonza]

When you refitted the adjuster screw did you mount it the right way around? (ie the "fixed" end should be at the rear and the extending end toward the front of the vehicle).
If there tension in the cable? (check at the equalizer).

A common problem is not sitting the cable guide flush to the shoe. Which is what I suspect is the problem from seeing the second picture.

ah yes, the good ol' re-assembling incorrectly trick. common with drum brakes or anything else.

a lot to be said about taking a few happy snaps prior to dismantling and using a procedure

[maggoo]

Hey guys

Thanks for everyone's input

I'll take my drums off tomorrow when i have time and check everything over again.
Then ill try adjustment again

I'll give an update on how i went afterwards

Cheers

[Sontssonts]

a lot to be said about taking a few happy snaps prior to dismantling and using a procedure

or doing one at a time to compare!

OP - you dont need a handbrake, just carry around a few chunks of timber:)

[maggoo]

Yeah i did take photos prior
And i did one at a time
I'm fairly sure i put them all back together correctly but i will check again.
I followed this guide while doing it.
http://www.4x4xplor.com/drum-brakes.html

[Jonny Jeep]

To make sure the cable guide is seated properly try an slide a feeler gauge behind it, or if you don't have a set handy, the end of a cable tie or even a piece of paper. If the guide is seated correctly you won't get anything behind it.

[maggoo]

as you have had your brakes pulled apart you need to do a full set up

place jack stands under the rear axle and have both wheels off the ground

make sure the hand brake is released and back off the cable adjusting nut under the vehicle until cable is a little loose

remove the plug from the access hole on the brake support plate on both sides. the support plate is the sheet metal plate on the inboard side of the brakes and the access hole pretty well aligns with the star wheel. shine a torch in there and you should see it.

with a flat bladed screwdriver poke the blade thru the access hole and engage the adjusting star wheel

rotate the star wheel until drag can be felt on the wheel while turning it. the star wheel has a detent action and can only be turned one way, so trial and error to work out which direction. the opposite star adjuster on the other wheel will revolve the opposite direction, well, at least on all the brakes that I have ever worked on do.

adjust the cable back up until taught and test handbrake so when it is applied is tight onto the drum and the hand brake lever can be felt firm onto the drum, in other words the hand brake lever should only pull back a few clicks on the ratchet if all done ok

test vehicle and drive in reverse and apply brake pedal bringing jeep to a FULL stop in order for the auto adjusters to equalise. do this a few times, forward and reverse. Full stops must be executed otherwise complete waste of time. don't use the handbrake for doing this otherwise you will stretch the cable

if all the above fails and you really don't know what you are doing, take it to a brake specialist as they are too important to stuff around with. besides, brake repairs aren't that expensive anyway

OK well i have checked and re checked everything and it is all in the right spot now. Turned out that the new spring that came in a kit that held the adjuster lever in was different to the original and wasn't holding it properly.
Swapped the old one in now the lever is holding correctly.

I went through you instructions bonza but am still having problems.
I cannot get the handbrake to do much unless i tighten the starwheel so much that the wheel doesn't move very well.

I had a play around with the drum off to see how far the handbrake moves the shoes and it is very minimal.
It is like the cable isn't pushing the shoes out enough.
Would this indicate i need to tighten the cable more?

Apart from my handbrake, the pedal brake works fine and stops the wheels easily when jacked up.


Cheers,
Paul

[bonza]

ok, back to basics. should have mentioned to accurately measure the drum to make sure it isnt worn or machined oversize. not sure what size it is meant to be but should be stamped in the drum.

also trace the cables under the vehicle from each drum to where they terminate at the equaliser and the tensioner rod. the tensioner rod connects to a cable that goes to the handbrake lever and has an adjusting nut. you can tighten this in order to shorten the cables thus taking up all the slack in the cables if they have been stretched or have been replaced

[Sontssonts]

Te equalizer would be my guess as well. It's in the bottom of the tub in the middle of the seats towards the back. Should have a long thread with an adjuster nut....

[maggoo]

OK i will try to measure the drums tomorrow

I have tightened the equalizer already until there is no slack in it.
Maybe i haven't tightened it enough.
Just did it till the equalizer felt firm

[maggoo]

OK

I have measured the drums and they are fine

I noticed the new spring i got for the parking brake strut was bigger and alot more heavy duty than the old one.
I decided to change it back to the old one and then tried adjusting them again and it seemed fine when i had it jacked up.
I then did the drive forward/back and coming to a complete stop and it seemed to unadjust them.

Now it doesn't hold.
I'm back to square one haha

[Tassie Jeeper]

OK

I have measured the drums and they are fine

I noticed the new spring i got for the parking brake strut was bigger and alot more heavy duty than the old one.
I decided to change it back to the old one and then tried adjusting them again and it seemed fine when i had it jacked up.
I then did the drive forward/back and coming to a complete stop and it seemed to unadjust them.

Now it doesn't hold.
I'm back to square one haha

my auto adjusters have never worked i have adjusted my brakes and handbrake and it works good for about a week then nothing.

took it the the brake place same thing i now have no brakes in the rear at all i have given up on them for now and will either do disc brake conversion or axle swap and be ridden of the $#!+ forever